~~~~Question of the Week~~~~
From: The Snider's Web
Hi Jill and Heather,
Love the roundtable e-mails-they give me a lot of useful information.
Search engine submissions sometimes take more time than designing a
web site!
On to my question...
The first site that I submitted to Yahoo.com actually made it into
their database-at the time I did not know how lucky I was!!! I have never
been able to duplicate that success with them, no matter what I try. I have
read their guidelines a million times and follow them to the letter. Is
there any advice you can give about Yahoo...because the word I think of when
I think of them is not Yahoo-it is unprintable!
Thanks for listening,
Lisa Snider
President, The Snider's Web
Web Site: http://www.thesnidersweb.com
~~~Jill's Response~~~
Lisa,
Good question! Yahoo! can definitely be a tough nut to crack, yet as
you pointed out, it's an extremely valuable place to be listed. Back
in the old days when Yahoo! was fairly new (say like '95 or so?) they
were pretty diligent about adding sites that were submitted. As they
grew and grew, it seems that they simply couldn't keep up with the
demand. Over the years I found they were extremely responsive to
non-commercial type sites, such as schools and hobby sites. They
were quick to add them when submitted (within a week) and even fairly
quick to change them if a URL changed and it was submitted to them.
Even today, I still find them quick to add and change these types of
sites.
Business and other commercial sites are another matter entirely.
Before they implemented their Business Express option where they
guarantee that they will "consider" your site for review for a
non-refundable $199, it was very hit or miss whether or not they'd add
a submitted site. Local businesses such as doctors and dentist sites
seemed to get added fairly quickly (for me at least), but most other
e-commerce type sites seemed to languish in oblivion as far as Yahoo!
was concerned. There was no way to know if they ever even looked at
sites that were submitted. You would submit and then simply never hear
from them.
Eventually, they did implement a special email address: url-support@yahoo-inc.com, which you could write to and check on your
submission. Before writing to them, however, you had to have
submitted your site on 2 different occasions, 6 weeks (or so) apart.
You also had to have the exact dates of your submittals, and the
categories and descriptions that you submitted. I found that using
that email address would very often do the trick and the site in
question would suddenly appear in the directory within a few weeks.
If you use that address and have the proper info that they want, and
your site still doesn't get added within 6 weeks or so, it's highly
likely that there's some reason that they don't want to add your site,
as evidenced by the following story:
I recently had a client's site which I had optimized a few years ago.
This site was in the top 10 in nearly all the engines for years under his
particular keywords. I had submitted to Yahoo! a number of times
without results. A few months ago, the site owner asked me what we
might do with Yahoo! and I remembered about the special email address.
I always keep logs on when I submit sites and the descriptions, etc.,
so I wrote to Yahoo! with this info. Six weeks later, still no site.
My feeling was that perhaps now that their Paid Business Express
service was working in full force it might be impossible to get a site listed
without paying the fee. I discussed this with the client, and even
though he was on a very low budget, he decided it would probably be
worth it if it would get his site listed in Yahoo!.
I submitted the site through the Biz Express. A week later he got an
email from Yahoo! saying that his site was rejected due to lack of
significant content. OUCH! I had never had a site get rejected
before, and was very much in a state of shock. Although I had told
this client that there's no guarantee that you'll get into Yahoo!,
most sites do seem to get in via this method. Of course, I felt
terrible about the rejection. I looked at the other sites in his
category, and could see no significant difference between many of them
and my client's site. My client's site seemed to me to have even more
content than some of the others. I believe the problem with the site
as Yahoo! saw it, was that it was only a 2 page site. The site sells
depression glass and the main page discussed what depression glass is,
and the 2nd page listed all of the pieces my client currently had for
sale, with an order form to request information. Simple and to the
point.
Luckily, Yahoo! allows their rejected sites one appeal. It has to be
made within 30 days of their rejection, so I had to work fast. I was
determined not to lose my client's $199 and was even prepared to eat
the cost of it myself if the appeal didn't work. I was fairly certain
that if we could add a bit more content and/or simply spread the site
out over a few more pages, that we would win the appeal. I thought
that we could add an About Us page and asked the client to write me up
something about how he and his wife got started in the depression
glass business. Then I took his Order Form and put it on a new
"Order" page. So now we were up to 4 pages without
actually adding much content. For good measure, I made an additional
link that said "contact us" which linked to the contact info at the
bottom of the main page. I also reorganized his items on the sales
page, by putting some category headings at the top of the page with
quick links to the items below. I put all of these new page links on
each site page, at the top and the bottom.
I felt we were now ready to appeal! To be extra sure that we were
given another look, I found the other pages Yahoo! had listed in the
same category that had less content than my client's site, and pointed
them out in my appeal letter. I also told them that we did add
additional content to our site, and asked them to please give it another
look. Within a week or so, my client got the approval letter and we
were all relieved! It was definitely an interesting learning
experience, that is for sure.
Now that I've shared all that, the answer to your question on how to
deal with Yahoo! is that it depends. If you have the time and don't
mind waiting a few months, try to submit once (keeping good records),
then submit again in 6 weeks. If after another 4 - 6 weeks you're
still not in, then write to the email address provided above and be
sure to give them all of the relevant information. If you still don't
get in within another few weeks, then take a good hard look at your
site and try to figure out if there's some reason why Yahoo! isn't
adding it. Are there enough pages? My guess is that any 2 page site
is probably automatically rejected. Are there other problems with it?
If you truly feel that you've done the best you can, and you can
afford the $199, then the Business Express would be your next option.
If nothing else, they'll at least let you know WHY they're not adding it.
If you don't want to go through all of the waiting, I highly suggest
going straight to the Business Express and plunking down the $199 from
the start. Under most circumstances it works like a charm and your
site will be added. Be very, very careful with the description you
submit to them, however. Think short, but try and get your most
important keywords into it. If you go for a long one, they'll simply
edit it however they like and most likely it won't be very helpful to
you.
As an aside, I'm extremely interested in hearing from others out there
that may have been rejected by the paid Yahoo! Business Express
Service. If your site was rejected, please send me a quick email
(jill@rankwrite.com)
telling me why they rejected your site, and what
(if anything) you did to "fix" your site, and whether or not you won
an appeal with them. If we get enough email on this, perhaps we could
have a special issue. I think it would be extremely helpful for us to
hear some of the reasons why actual sites get rejected, and what it
takes to win an appeal. If you lost an appeal, I'd love to hear about
that also. I also imagine that some of you have gotten added through
the Business Express but have not been happy with the category or
description that you got listed with. If you've successfully (or
unsuccessfully) appealed those, I'd love to know about these also!
Jill
~~~Send Us Your Questions~~~
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